Here on the holiday of Thanksgiving in the US in 2025, join us for a chat about Rhea’s experience as a Chaplain, and the idea of finding a bit of slower “turtle time” when we need it. Rhea leads us in a guided meditation in which we can rest, welcome all of ourselves, and let it allll jussst beeee. She guides us to make friends with the breath as we gently relax and follow her voice. Whether you are a caregiver, harried cook, newly bereaved, with people or solo, celebrating or not excited about the upcoming holidays…this episode invites you into a world of stillness that is always close by.

For more information on Best Life Best Death please visit our website at ⁠⁠www.bestlifebestdeath.com⁠⁠.
Follow us on our social channels to receive pertinent and helpful resources on death, grieving, and more at:
Facebook: ⁠⁠www.facebook.com/bestlifebestdeath⁠⁠
Instagram: ⁠⁠www.instagram.com/bestlifebestdeath⁠⁠

Transcript:

Diane Hullet: [00:00:00] Hi, I am Diane Hallett and you’re listening to the Best Life Best Death podcast. Today I am talking with Ria Mater, my friend and colleague, and you know, a lovely guest that I’ve had on before. Welcome, rhe. Thank you Diane. It’s good to be back. It’s good to be back. We spoke on episode number 80 and episode number 1 65, and this is episode number 2 21 and it’s a special Thanksgiving episode in 2025.

So I’m, I’m happy to have you here. You’re always just such a grounded presence and bring so much to the end of life field. Do you wanna just describe a little about what you do, how you got into the work?

Rhea Mader: Yeah, I love how you say grounded presence. ’cause I think that’s really the intention for our conversation today is about grounded presence.

And I think that’s probably the motivation for my work is I had exp an experience with stillbirth and in that experience I felt like there’s all these protocols and things [00:01:00] happening around me, but not the grounded presence that I needed the support in. And so I think that was part of my call.

Toward end of life is having this invitation to how can we create this more grounded presence when we are with people in these times of like major life transitions that really really shift our existence. And so that’s part of the purpose of my work is coming to this place of grounded presence.

Beautiful.

Diane Hullet: Yeah, and I’ll just say too, you know, RIA is a death doula end of life practitioner. She’s a meditation guide and she leads a beautiful course called Apprenticeship with Death that I think has been really meaningful to your participants. Yeah. What, say just a tiny bit about apprenticeship with death.

What, what do people learn in that?

Rhea Mader: Yeah, so apprenticeship with death is a five-ish plus month journey. And in that experience, people really come in this, we, we begin with grounded [00:02:00] presence, right? Because you can’t enter into anything or hold space for anyone else without be coming into this place of groundedness and presence.

And I think it’s also a really. Steep reflection on the wounds that we carry into. ’cause I think a lot of times we’re called to end of life because we have our own experiences, which oftentimes includes maybe a woundedness or a trauma or something like that. And so I think what I’ve witnessed is a lot of people coming to this work because they have experienced things like that.

And there’s this kind of, internal call maybe to kind of go into a place where we can heal that. And that’s part of my work in apprenticeship with death is recognizing where our wounds are, being with that in a, in a really compassionate way, and then uncovering how do we want to serve in end of life.

And so I have people come through that. I would say have adjacent careers like acupuncture, occupational therapy, stuff like that. [00:03:00] And then I have people who really want to work as practitioners, as independent entrepreneurs. And then I also have people who enter the program that are. Maybe looking for a more personal approach, like they’re doing this for themselves and maybe for their, their family or whatever.

So yeah, a a lot of different ways people enter, and I think in some ways everyone leaves with the same thing, right? Like this healing presence, this deeper understanding, and this desire to maybe like shift and change how we are holding space for death and grief. Beautiful. Yeah.

Diane Hullet: It, it fits so beautifully.

I, I love what our colleague, you know, Sarah Kerr says. What, you know, thank you for being part of the movement to do death better. Right. Like we just, I think many of us have this, this strong belief that we can do death better. It’s, it’s hard, it’s sad, it’s intense. It’s the biggest transformation we go through.

And we [00:04:00] can do it better than we do. And so I think programs like yours, apprenticeship with death really strive for that. And part of that is this, this slowing down. So we talked about putting up an episode today that would be kind of this invitation to slow down in this busy season, in this busy time, in this fractured time, fragmented time.

And especially r and I both have a real tenderness for caregivers, I think. And what. They go through in how stretched they are with their multiple roles usually.

Rhea Mader: Yeah,

Diane Hullet: absolutely.

Rhea Mader: And I, I think as you’re talking about that too, I’m reflecting on my experience working as a chaplain. And my first experience working as a chaplain was in an a long-term care center and.

That was like a real grounding space where I could spend a lot of time with people. I got to get into like real relational aspects with people. And then I also worked in a hospital in a level one [00:05:00] trauma hospital as a chaplain. And that was a completely different pace. And so from my experience of that, I got to watch how people are with one another, but also in, in my experience of how I am with people and.

And I think there was this real turning point for me after my time working in the hospital where I was like. I personally like, just need this time where I can like stop have these pauses, have this reflection time and turn inward. And what I, one thing that I just wanna share this, ’cause I think that it kind of brings it all home is during my time working at the hospital, I kind of like was.

Why is this so different? Like, I’m working as a chaplain, the work is the same, but I was like, the environments were so completely different. And so I developed this motto for myself, which is turtle time. And, and that was the, that’s the world that I like to live in, right where I’m, I’m moving at this turtle pace and things are happening a lot slower around me.[00:06:00]

And it doesn’t mean that we can’t operate in these fast, fast paced ways. I mean, I think that’s kind of part of living in the world now, but also noticing when we need to take those times to slow down, to pause, to kind of like go into our, our little turtle shell and and find these places of rejuvenation and healing and reflection.

Diane Hullet: I love that. And I’m laughing ’cause just this morning I somehow went to sleep last night with like, oh, I’m gonna get so much done in the morning. You know, like I just had some idea about like 12 things I was gonna do before 11 o’clock, and number one, it was totally unrealistic. Number two, what happened was I needed turtle time this morning, and if I had named that when I woke up, I wouldn’t have felt so, I don’t know, kind of grumpy and unproductive, you know, like.

Just know that you needed turtle time. And I finally right before you and I got on the Zoom, I was like, oh, for gosh sakes, Diane, go take a walk. Like, just, just accept that you are a little slower today. And those 12 things, not even three of those things are [00:07:00] going to get done. So I, I really like naming that and sort of taking it specifically, especially in this world where many of us are just connected all the time to work, to phone to people, to communities, to relationships.

For better and for lack of turtle time.

Rhea Mader: Right? Yeah. And in the midst of so many things that are happening in, in our world right now. And also holding space for. The ones who maybe aren’t so connected like that, they need more connection. And, and that’s a real hope that I have from my work and my practice too, is that we can find ways to have more interconnectedness and find these places where when we wake up and we’re like, oh, I have all these things to do today and I don’t know how I’m gonna get it done, that we can reach out to others and say, I need support.

I need help. You know, then, then we have that community to help lift us along. Beautiful.

Diane Hullet: Well, let’s let’s, we’re go into this meditation, [00:08:00] this invitation to slow down and, and if you wanna preface it with anything, please do. Yes, I absolutely do.

Rhea Mader: So I think that sometimes people have a real aversion to meditation because I think it could come across as this way of being like.

Really rigid and res restrictive and like we have to sit in lotus pose on the floor. And my way of learning meditation is not like that at all. And so, you know, gratitude to my teachers and the lineages that I’ve learned from, and. Also just inviting people to, to just welcome all that’s coming in, right?

So one of my teachers, Lauren, he says that your to-do list is holy. And what he means by that is welcome, everything. So sometimes when we sit down in meditation or lay down in reflection where these times of pause, like all the things are coming into our brain, and so we’re like, I have to do this. I have to do the laundry.

I have to, you know, X, Y, Z. And so we’re going [00:09:00] through this whole list. In tantric yoga, which is a a practice that I am trained in, or lineage that I’m trained in, there’s a Sanskrit sayings like Netty, Netty and netty. Netty means not this, not that. And so when we are in meditation, we’re having all these things come into our mind, like laundry.

We can just say, not this, not this. Right? And so in a way. We’re welcoming our holy to-do list, right? Like we’re letting it come in, but we’re also saying that’s not who I am. Right? And so like when we think about emotions, like big emotions that might be coming up or any emotions, right, or feelings or thoughts, that that’s not who we are.

So we can just be with this invitation of watching whatever comes, and then also letting it go. And so one of the things that I wanna say as I’m prefacing [00:10:00] this meditation is that, in, in my way of being with meditation is we’re welcoming all of ourselves, right? So we may want to invite ourselves to move, we want, may want to invite ourselves to lie down.

But whatever, in whatever way, shape, form we’re being with meditation, we’re, we’re inviting ourself to trust our instincts, to welcome all of the parts of us. Just be with what is be with what arises. And the more and more we practice this, the more and more we can let the thoughts move faster out or maybe not even have them enter in.

And so it is a devotion. It’s a devotion. I love that. Yeah. So the. Invitation for this meditation is just to be with a breath, to make friends with a breath, and to find that [00:11:00] place where we’re really nurturing compassion for ourselves, right? So, like you said, Diane, you were going through your to-do list and you’re thinking of all this stuff, and you found this place where you’re like, for goodness sakes, like, just go on a walk.

And so for me that was like you finding this place of nurturing compassion within yourself. So as we, as I guide you through this, I just invite you to be with all of your senses, flow with whatever arrives be with whatever rhythms, whatever movement, whatever, whatever you feel like needs to be, then invite that to be.

So just begin to notice the body and just begin to notice like, what is it that you. Maybe need for support in this moment. Maybe you need a blanket or something behind your back, like we don’t have to sit up super straight. We could lie down and there’s a [00:12:00] lot of things happening in the world right now.

In our communities, in our personal lives. And so maybe also just noticing that there’s some tightness in the body and maybe wanna shake it out. So maybe there’s some invitation for moving. Rolling the shoulders over the neck. Yeah. Big stretch overhead. The more we can tune in to noticing what’s happening in the body, the more we can begin to respond to what we need and offer that to ourselves.

So as we continue to tune in more and more to the body, we can just begin to notice how it is that we’re breathing

and there’s nothing to shape or change about the breath. We’re just allowing it to arrive however it is.

If you desire to have movement in your body, you can gently sway or rock. [00:13:00] And if you are swaying or rocking, just imagine yourself like the tall prairie grass, or a tree swaying in the wind.

And as you’re noticing your breath. Just continue this journey in word, inviting yourself into this world of inner stillness and maybe even outer stillness.

And then just begin to feel the places where your body

Speaker 3: meets the earth.

Rhea Mader: Sensing or feeling. Earth itself beneath you, supporting you and knowing that support is always there, it’s always available.

And if the outer body is still moving, that’s okay. Just know that inner stillness is still available to you,

[00:14:00] and then just begin to notice the natural flow of the breath moving in and out.

Again, there’s nothing you have to do or shift or change. Just welcoming the breath exactly how it is,

and with each breath feeling you are worthy of this breath.

And with each breath, the inner and the outer become a little bit more aligned,

finding a rhythm.

And the inner stillness is reflected, and then outer stillness.

And then bringing the awareness of the breath at the nostrils,

just noticing the path that the breath travels, expanding into the lungs. Noticing that place of transition and [00:15:00] then responding and flowing, the natural flow of breath and noticing as it leaves just beyond the nostrils

and just being with this flow of the breath in the nostrils.

And leaving the nostrils

for the next three breaths on your own.

And wherever you are in the counting, just letting that go and just letting the breath become really soft and barely audible.

And feeling now as if the body is being breathed, there’s nothing you have to do.

And as you are receiving this birthright of breath, you begin to soften.

Noticing the forehead soften.

The center of the forehead, soften

the eyes and the eyebrows [00:16:00] soften

the throat. Shoulders, the chest and the belly and the fingertips soften

the pelvic bowl, the hips,

Speaker 3: the legs soften,

Rhea Mader: the buttocks. The backs of the legs, the feet soften

the whole back. The shoulder blades and the arms can soften.

And as you begin to soften even more and more, perhaps you notice there’s even more spaciousness.

Inner spaciousness, outer spaciousness.

[00:17:00] Feeling the vibration of softness move through your whole body.

Infusing your bones, your blood, all your cells,

Speaker 3: your DNA,

softening.

Softening even more.

Rhea Mader: Continuing to feel this vibration of softness throughout your whole body.

And then letting your awareness rest at your heart center, this spiritual heart center, deep in the center of the chest,

receiving the vibration of love.

Receiving the vibration of love,

Speaker 3: receiving the vibration of love.

Rhea Mader: And when you’re ready and not before, just take your sweet time slowly beginning to deepen your breath.

Remembering where you are.

Remembering that [00:18:00] you have a body

noticing how you feel.

Maybe even taking some time to stretch or respond to whatever the body is asking as you begin to come back

and as you are in this place of bringing your awareness back. Maybe there’s something that you want to remember and so you might wanna free write about what has arrived in your awareness from this practice or what you want to remember. And so this might be what you received from this meditation. Super simple, what you want to remember.

Then also, how do you want to receive support?

And as you take time to free write, just let whatever arrives just flow. You don’t have to worry about punctuation, about spelling, about [00:19:00] grammar, any of that. Just let it flow. And if you continue to do this practice, you’ll find something new every single time. And so my gratitude for being with you and sharing this and offering this as a way to slow down and soften, and just coming into this place of remembering that we have this light that shines from within us, and when we contend that and nurture it and offer compassion to ourselves, then we can also then offer that to the world.

So thank you.

Diane Hullet: Thank you R. Thank you. This image of the softness vibrating throughout I found really beautiful. I could, I could just feel that as like a tangible thing, that there is this softening that’s possible and that that was very brief, you know? And yet what a shift we can make [00:20:00] in how we are standing in ourselves.

Rhea Mader: Yeah, and I, I did move through it faster than I typically would have, but, I think a really good takeaway for this, especially for me when I reflect on my work in the hospital. ’cause there’s not a lot of places that one could go and like, kind of like decompress or whatever. And, and even as householders, like we don’t have a lot of time sometimes that we can carve out like 30 minutes to sit in meditation.

And so even if we’re taking like. Three seconds or three minutes just to be with the deepening of the breath and noticing that flow of the breath being, being received into our body. And then exhaling like that alone is a practice enough, right? And so we don’t have to have this dedication of being like 20 minutes meditation every day.

If that’s something that feels overwhelming at first, like just, just breathe, just be with the breath. [00:21:00]

Diane Hullet: I think especially in challenging times, maybe the holidays, maybe some part of today, Thanksgiving, you’re, you’re, there’s heightened emotions or heightened frustration or something. Finding just a little way to soften, a little way to slow down might be just the thing.

Well, RIA, how can people

Rhea Mader: find out more about the work you do? My work is at c conscious Living, conscious Dying. So you can just go to Conscious Living conscious dying.com and you’ll find all kinds of resources and offers there. So we can connect there or I’m not really great about social media, but you could find me on Instagram or LinkedIn.

Beautiful

Diane Hullet: and, and for next October, R just completed a really beautiful course about ancestors that I just love that you do every year around that time. So keeping that in mind. Well, thanks for joining me. Thank you, Diane. Hope listeners take away something calming and quieting and soothing and slowing [00:22:00] down from today’s episode.

I think this this counts as a best life episode, so yes. Speeding to the best death. That’s right. That’s right. As always, you can find out more about the work I do at bestlifebestdeath.com. Thanks so much for listening.